I was just thinking about the literal reset of the Island that Juliet possibly created when she pounded that bomb into exploding. If it indeed did what Daniel said it would, does that mean that we'll be seeing old faces return to the show?
I think this was most foreshadowed by Sun's picking up of Charlie's ring. Why bring that back after so long if it wasn't important? My opinion: Charlie will return to the show next year. Dominic Monaghan has expressed interest in returning, and I think that this would be the absolute best way for it to happen. We could also see the returns of Boone, Shannon, Eko, Libby...
But then there's the rather strong argument that it would render the emotion of the first five seasons rather pointless. However, I think it would be great to see some new characters back. What do you think?
i think you are right... notice that Jacob, in the flashbacks, physically touched some of the characters in some way or another... up until jack and the candy bar i thought he was 'marking' them with direct physical contact, but he clearly didn't connect with Jack directly, only through the Apollo bar..., so assuming that was Charlie's guitar case in the taxi... then yeah, i think we will be seeing him again... which i kinda like the idea of... Boone and Shannon i could do without... Charlie's death is the only one that really brought a tear to my eye... he truely died a hero...
ReplyDeletei don't see how everyone feels that the "reset" changes everything.
ReplyDeletehasn't it been shown through desmond that people's minds, and memories can exist on multiple planes?
faraday, talks to desmond, outside the hatch after a time skip. as far as i can tell, that DIDN'T happen before, cause des wakes up with a new "memory." he remembers an event from his past that hadn't happened to him in his current timeline. this is a memory that he never had until the very moment that faraday altered it.
isn't it possible, that after the reset, the losties could still have foggy or even clear memories of the alternate timeline that they lived through?
i think they will have very clear memories of what they lived through... i don't think they will be continuing on to LAX like they think they will... jacob's last words are 'they're coming'... he touched them... marked them, in a sense that they would return to him at his death... i think jacob knows full well what is going on, and i don't think a little acupuncture and roasting is going to be the end of him...[i meant to point this out in my first post up there, but couldn't find an edit button, and didn't want to go bogarting the first two posts..]
ReplyDeletedamn... need an edit button... up until the Hurley section of the flashback, i thought Jacob was 'marking' them to ensure they got on the plane... but given that H's section is AFTER they return to the island, it seems to me that he was protecting them [to possibly ensure they would live through the bomb blast, in which case bye bye Juliet :(] or in some way putting a 'tractor beam' of sorts on them to return to his time/space upon his death... either way Jacob has a clear idea of how the pieces move upon the board...
ReplyDeletewho is the man that killed jacob and lives in locke's body?!?
ReplyDeletehttp://ambassadorstotheworld.tumblr.com/
Yes, the guitar that Jacob left with Hurley has GOT to be Charlie's and it, and the ring, are either for Charlie or they're for Aaron.
ReplyDeleteI agree that Jacob is in the 'know' Of the millions of details in the show, during the recap Damon Lindelof mentioned the guitar case specifically and I don't think it to be a red herring. Showing Charlie's ring and basing a scene in the cab with Hurley and the guitar, certainly seems to be pointing. So Jacob using Charlie's body could be a possibility. Another possibility, that would prove interesting, is Jacob using Locke's body as well. Illiana and Bram carting Locke's body to the statue could have been more than to just prove a point.
ReplyDeleteA battle of Locke's would be an interesting dichotomy for the final season.
I for one don't see how Juliet's detonation of the bomb changed anything. What they did to attempt to stop the incident, IS the incident, as Miles suggests. Yes, the whole show would be rendered pointless otherwise. What happened, happened. It is not some mystical magical notion of 'destiny' that mandates this, it is basic cause and effect.
ReplyDeletedave'slost: the "moment" that Farady spoke to Desmond in the past, WAS in the far past, not in Desmond's present when he woke up and realized that memory. He HAS always had that memory, it just didn't occur to him as important until later in the game. The show gives the illusion that those things are happening simultaneously through these flashbacks/flashforwards, but they are not.
My thought on Jacob's tagging of the survivors: what if his physical contact with them - either by touching them or handing them an object - somehow predisposes them physically to be drawn to the island, maybe via radiation? Perhaps this is why Eloise said that ALL of them have to go back if they are to have the best chances of making it: the combined radiation/Jacob influence of all of them is necessary to crash the plane. It's kinda out there, but just a thought.
Hurley's flashback didn't happen after they returned to the island, maybe you meant something else... At any rate, there's no way the writer's will negate the first 4 seasons and "undo" it all. It doesn't fit with their view of time travel. There are other ways to incorporate old characters again.
ReplyDeleteIdea/theory: Jacob and the other guy are gods that play a game with each other to entertain themselves because being gods, they have seen and done it all. When the dark shirt god says to Jacob "You know how bad I want to kill you", he means it in a way that is similar to like check mate in chess and whoever kills the other first wins the game and then it will need new characters to play again. In the rules they must not engage each other directly or reveal themselves to the characters. My guess is the god in the black shirt has not won in a long time and really wants to kill Jacob to win for once. The Island is the chess board and all that happens are within the rules of the game laid out by the gods themselves. They may use any and all means necessary to achieve a victory including psychological manipulation. Think about how many times, even since season one, that games and colors of playing pieces are referenced. Hence all the black and white items on the island. Remember when Jack first found the black and white rock on the skeleton in the caves and when Locke first had the backgammon board on the beach??? What are your thoughts on this?
ReplyDeletepretty much what i thought, 'cept that they warein exile on out plane of existance and that higher gods have set the no killing rule... [and i think that jacob is Sobek, and the 'other guy', the smoke monster, is Anubis]
ReplyDeleteLook up on wikipedia "Jacob's Ladder"...my husband and I theorize that the survivors are descendants of Jacob. East, West....well, Sun & Jin, Sayid, Americans...?? Just a thought. I think Jacob is a "good guy"
ReplyDeleteIt would be awesome to see the old characters. However, is it not possible that they regain their memory somehow? I know it doesn't quite work like that - how can you remember what didn't happen. But I imagine that the writer's will have fun with the time strands, also the writer's will not simply undo the character's history.
ReplyDeletePlease don't be upset with me for this post. I just wanted to see if any of you have had similiar theories. The finale was wonderful and we have months to blog and worry over this.
ReplyDeleteI know the writers have stated that aliens from other worlds are not the answer, but they also lied about there not being anything to do with time travel.
I think it would be lame, but maybe these writers can pull it off. What if Jacob, Dark guy are just stranded beings from another galaxy/universe? Maybe the whole point of these games are to get back home (not ET style I hope). That they got stuck on Earth wayyyyyyyy back and we came to know them as the Egytians or whatever. In the whatever that sucked them thru to Earth there was no one who knew how to get back plus the humans here hadn't advanced technically enough to creat something to send them back.
They are stuck and helpless without being able to lure people here that just might fix things. Down thru time they have played things out searching for the right group to fix this for them. The DI had the money and the knowledge to work this out. I keep thinking of Dr.Chang in that video talking about the "pinhole" not lasting long enough. We aren't talking just zipping back and forth here, but probably a black hole connection between space and time.
The blackhole they rode in on closed up and now they are stuck til someone can reestablish that connection. I am thinking of Stargate I guess with their passageways between places.
They aren't gods; just extremely long lived creatures who take forms that don't scare the bejesus out of the earthlings. Or perhaps jacob and unlocke are just the last of the creatures stranded here. This time they have to get it right.
Just a thought to try out here.
There are some production issues surrounding a comeback for the dead characters; depending upon when and where the next season picks up, we might suddenly be needing to see a lot of dead characters again: Boone, Shannon, Michael, Ana Lucia, Libby, Eko, Ethan, Goodwin, Nikki, Paolo, Charlie, Alex, Karl, Danielle, Charlotte, Daniel, Abbadon, Arzt, Frogurt....
ReplyDeleteIt adds up to a lot of actors and just doesn't seem like a realistic expectation to me (though I'd love it).
I want Mr Ecko if we see him again I'll be happy
ReplyDeleteI think your idea is rather unrealistic.
ReplyDelete#1: All the progress(a lot of positive) of the characters we love would have been for nothing.
And it would play out to be very predictable.
#2: You wont see Eko again...because he(the actor) gets REALLY sick on Hawaii, that's why he left the show prematurely. They previously planned for him bigger stuff(similar to what Locke is in the show now)
I agree with "Ben". I think it is a long shot to think that the bomb "reset" everything.
ReplyDelete1. There is no way they can get all of the actors back, and Walt is too old anyway.
2. Even if they all just "went their own way" afer the plane landed in LAX, the story would have to reintroduce the main characters to each other again AND then get them BACK to the island to do whatever it is they are supposed to do (and we just did that)...all in 17 episodes.
3. Unless there were "multiple timelines" the reset would invalidate the current "present" of 2007...which would undo all of what fake-Locke, Ben, Sun, Richard, and Jacob have done.
4. If there ARE multiple timelines..."only 17 episodes" left...not enough time.
5. Everything that happened in '77 setup the CURRENT timeline...no matter who tried to change what. It was Daniel's belief that he could CHANGE the future that led him to be shot by his mother which FULFILLED the "what happened happened" concept.
Here is an interesting idea.
ReplyDeleteWhat if the "He who will save us" line isn't directed at Jacob, who doesn't lie "in the shadow" but inside the statue, but comes to mean someone who will eventually lie in the shadow of the statue.
Maybe season 6 will open with Jack and the others being timejumped to the present...in the shadow of the statue.
Fade-in, close-up on Jack's eye. The camera pulls back and he's in a shaded area...pull back some more and BAM, hes (and maybe the others) is shown to be in the shadow of the statue (or I guess it's foot at this point).
I wouldn't bet on this happening, but I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility either.
If this Jacob enemy is really in Locke's body, how come he didn't remember the big foot hideout where Jacob is?
ReplyDeleteJscob does live in the shadow of the statue. there is a big opening in the roof right beneath the statua, therefor in the shadow.
ReplyDeleteDid anyone catch that Ben was truthful throughout the entire finale?
ReplyDelete^No he wasn't. He said he was a Pisces.
ReplyDeleteWhat lies in the shadow of the statue? He who will save us all. Jacob is that creature depicted by the statue and that other man is the smoke monster. So Jacob cannot lie in his own shadow, but the one who desires to attack him does. That kinda explains the sanctity of the temple and the ash around the cabin.
ReplyDeleteFrom the beginning of time there has been light and dark, night and day, good and evil... You get the message. Now in saying this, I would like you to consider my theory and how it relates to what you know and have seen on the "LOST" series.
ReplyDeleteTheory:
After seeing the opening seen of season 5 finale I have came to realize there was a reason the man in the black shirt was not named. The man in the black shirt is also Jacob. This is why they are unable to hurt one another. To be able to release themselves from the other they must find a loophole that will allow themselves to remain alive after destroying the other. Jacob is torn between his good and evil side. Together they bring balance to one another the world and Universe or whatever the case may wind up to be (hence Yin and Yang), if one were to lose the other, good or evil would dominate the world.
Think of the many times that black and white are referenced both visually and verbally throughout the season of LOST ever since the beginning episodes. The references are the biggest clue to the puzzle. Everything has an opposite, including magnetism, of course. I would like to hear your comments pertaining to my theory and I would also like you to comment on the times you have seen opposite things referenced on the series. Please also read Yin Yang page on Wikipedia.
Charlie wasn't touched by Jacob. As Johnny Utah would say "He's not coming back."
ReplyDeleteLost Theorist said...
ReplyDelete"From the beginning of time there has been light and dark, night and day, good and evil...my theory...
Theory:
After seeing the opening seen of season 5 finale I have came to realize there was a reason the man in the black shirt was not named. The man in the black shirt is also Jacob. This is why they are unable to hurt one another."
Very interesting! I like that! But then you said..
"...if one were to lose the other, good or evil would dominate the world."
So get ready for EVIL domination now? I hope not :)
MerLud said...
ReplyDelete"I for one don't see how Juliet's detonation of the bomb changed anything. What they did to attempt to stop the incident, IS the incident, as Miles suggests."
IMO the possible bomb detonation wasn't the incident--remember the part just before that, when all the metal was getting sucked-in to the hole? I think THAT was the incident...the bomb detonation was after that started. And btw, a pony nuke of that type (a fusion bomb trigger)would not likely destroy much of the island, if any, since it would be an underground explosion too.
Charlie wasn't touched by Jacob. As Johnny Utah would say "He's not coming back."
ReplyDeletehe didn't touch Jack either, but he did touch something that belonged to him...
i don't know this "Johnny Utah" of which you speak, but is it possible he could be wrong..?
Question- Aside from the fact that the man on the island told Jacob he wants to kill him, what makes him so 'bad' and Jacob so 'good'?
ReplyDeleteAs far as we know, Jacob may have already killed the other man before. Maybe Jacob is nicer, or has more manners. But just because someone offers his enemy fish to eat, doesn't mean he's necessarily the 'good' guy.
My theory about the last part of the season finale- When Jacob said 'they're coming', I believe he was referring to the ones that he had touched, or handed something to, outside of the island (as they had so obviously showed during the same episode). So the nuke that just went off near the electromagnetic field causes them to travel back to the statue, and join with Alana - one of whom he had also touched - and they are the 'fail safe' that Jacob is using in case he gets into a "check" with his opponent. "He who will save us" may be directed at Jack, who continues to lead the pack.
9 whole months! I could cry....
ReplyDeleteThe Guitar case with Hurley and ring picked up by Sun sure seem to suggest some connection with Charlie. It would be intriguing to see how this would pan out in the finale season.
ReplyDeleteNevertheless, the final season will be interesting no matter what!
The reference to Johnny Utah is from the movie Point Break (1991). Johnny Utah (Keanu Reeves) is a Special Agent for the FBI. Utah gets partnered with Angelo Pappas (Gary Busey) an experienced agent who is more than committed to his work. The two are asked to investigate the number of robberies committed by a group called the Ex-Presidents, who wears masks of Presidents Reagan, Nixon, Carter and Johnson for their robberies. Pappas has a theory that the Ex-Presidents are a group of surfers, and asks for Utah to go undercover as a surfer. Utah forms a close bond with Bodhi (Patrick Swayze) and his group, but the relationship between Utah and Bodhi becomes limited when Utah discovers that Bodhi and his group are the Ex-Presidents. In the last scene of the movie, Bodhi is swimming out to surf in the waves of the century in Australia. Utah says to the agents on the beach, “he (Bodhi) is not coming back”. Utah and the agents watch Bodhi catch his last wave and die in the blue crush.
ReplyDeleteHowever, Jacob does not have to touch the person to have an effect on their future. He handed Jack the Apollo candy bar. He placed Charlie’s guitar case in the cab next to Hurley. These objects would provide the needed link to Jacob.
Eloise Hawkins had Jack place something of his father’s, a pair of shoes, on John Locke’s body before Flight 316 left LA.
These objects provide a link to the island’s magical powers. The touch and/or the objects “bookmark” the selected people in some manner.
" Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteIf this Jacob enemy is really in Locke's body, how come he didn't remember the big foot hideout where Jacob is?"
Fri May 15, 12:56:00 PM PDT
I have been thinking about this as well- it didn't seem like "Flocke" realized exactly where he was when Richard told him they were outside Jacob's hideout. But once Flocke was inside the statue, Jacob instantly recognized him, and said, " I guess you found your loophole." We didn't think that necessarily made sense- unless it was part of the ruse that Flocke had to put on to continue keeping the Others leading him back there. But the face Flocke made when Richard announced they were there didn't seem to fit. Thoughts?
dave'slost said... "isn't it possible, that after the reset, the losties could still have foggy or even clear memories of the alternate timeline that they lived through?"
ReplyDeleteI have just rewatched (again) the opening of the very first episode. When Jack opens his eyes and realizes where he is, he then starts running through the woods to find the wounded as if he knows EXACTLY where to go. Maybe this particular scene has happened for Jack several times before.
Well, that is really interesting Emma...
ReplyDeleteI haven't seen this mentioned anywhere on this blog, so I'll toss it out and you can all decide its significance for yourselves:
Immediately after the credits, ABC ran a promo for season 6. At the end of the promo, we see the very first frames of “Pilot” – Jack’s left eye popping open while he’s on his back in the jungle.
If you doubt, check it out…
I haven’t found a good quality copy online, but YouTube has it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ze0VZ_68nzU
Compare with the 1st screencap for season 1, episode 1 at Screencaps.org
http://www.screencaps.org/SciFi/Lost/Season1/Episode1/
OK, it's his right eye, sorry.
ReplyDeleteTalking about the opening scene of season 5 finale... what if (in case that the ship we saw IS the Black Rock) the Black Rock crew's descendants are the people that we as "The Others"? Jacob and the bad guy (liked the evil Jacob theory) were pretty alone I guess that time.
ReplyDeleteI think the writers are both too clever and to conscious of their own historic place in television history to simply allow JR to walk out of the sower at the end of a dream.
ReplyDeleteIf anyone is worried that season 6 will simply be the plane landing in LA and how the lives of the people connect after getting of the flight, I think that is unnecessary worry.
I believe years ago, the writers knew exactly where they wanted the show to go from this point and the solution will fit with the time travel, the role of Jacob and the "good guys" from Ajira, even the Black Rock crew. We will find out who the Adam and Eve corpses were and most (but not all) of the other questions.
I would just remind people that the plots of years 2-5 were based upon a story arch, and while we may not like the conclusion, we can expect the quality writing to continue without a dues ex machina of a simple reset to Darma never ended and flight 815 landed.
While I think bringing old characters back would be ORGASMICALLY AWESOME, logistically it just won't happen. For one, Cynthia Watros (Libby) is definitely not looking to be onboard with Lost anymore, and I don't blame her either. For another, scheduling potentially a dozen actors to come back to the show at the same time seems just plain impossible.
ReplyDeleteIf this happens I will be so lost for words I will cry, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
What if they did reset... back on 815, all of them (which means Charlie, too)...
ReplyDelete...but they all also remember the Island and everything that happened to get them there?
One of the great things coming out of the last season is watching people line up for or against the reset based on whether they liked their life or not. Imagine what they would do and what others would do if they have everything old back and yet remember it all...
Juliet wakes up in the middle of a discussion of Carrie and she still has utterly lost Sawyer...
Charlie wakes up alive, stoned in an airplane toilet, convincing himself of a vivid hallucination based on people he saw in the cabin...
Kate in handcuffs and Jack in love with her...
Locke wakes up from dying and still without his legs...
And Desmond wakes up in the hatch, Penny lost to him, his son no more, and the siren is blasting to punch in the Numbers...
Hell of a way to start the last season of Lost...
i agree completely with have Charlie back in the show.
ReplyDeletei think that having dominic monaghan back in the show would be a fantastic decision to bring a bit of style back into the series. Also when Charlie and Hurley were together they were the best two characters in lost because they made the show a lot more enjoyable to watch. Im sure they will make the right decision in the end.
If the bomb in season 5 finale didnt go of then Dr. Chang must still be alive because in season 2 in the swan station the survivors watch him in the orientation video.
ReplyDeleteso remember if Dr. Chang is dead at the start of season 6 we will know if the bomb worked in anyway.
bit hard to understand maybe but a good way to learn if the bomb changed their lives in anyway.
bolo said: "And Desmond wakes up in the hatch, Penny lost to him, his son no more, and the siren is blasting to punch in the Numbers..."
ReplyDeleteEverything else you said makes sense, but this could not be. If indeed time has been reset, the point of detonating the pocket of electromagnetism was to prevent The Hatch from ever being built. Thus, no Hatch, no Button, no Desmond pushing it. While he may end up marooned on the island, he will never meet Kelvin in the Hatch and never be left to push the button, eventually failing and causing the crash of Oceanic 815.
Well i think there was no explotion and that fade to white was another time skip where our losties come back to their present, that's the reason why Jacob said: they're coming. And other thing to support this is that we watched videos of Dr. Chang wearing a protesis becouse he hurt his hand (now we know how), that can't happen if there's an explotion; also he explained that electromagnetic pulse and time skiping in those old videos.
ReplyDeleteThat fade to white reminds me when Ben moved the island and he appeared in the middle of nowhere. And remember what Jacob said " There is one end, the rest in between is just progress".
I don't understand how, if anti-Jacob is posessing Locke's body... how come there is another Locke's body?
ReplyDeleteWhat about Hurley's guitar? Could that be Charlie's?
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Essay_Concerning_Human_Understanding
ReplyDeleteI found this on Wikipedia. Very interesting. The next one is also very interesting. Has references to people named Hobbes and Rousseau. Hmmm. A link from this page will take you to the first where you will also see John Locke referenced from the 17th century.
ttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Essay_Concerning_Human_Understanding
ReplyDeleteI found this on Wikipedia. Very interesting. The next one is also very interesting. Has references to people named Hobbes and Rousseau. Hmmm. A link from this page will take you to the first where you will also see John Locke referenced from the 17th century.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tabula_rasa
Has anyone ever translated the heiroglyphs that popped up when they didn't put in the numbers in the hatch? Sorry if I missed it but thought it might be in play now with all the egyptian stuff...
ReplyDelete