Comments on Lostpedia Blog: Deconstructing: Jacob's nemesis

You've based this on your own interpretation of wh...

2009-10-18T18:17:37.382-07:00

You've based this on your own interpretation of what is happening. A lot of people have already decided in their minds that this jacob's nemesis is the reincarnated loch, but this has NOT been revealed on the show as you say and if anything all that has been really left is the question of is he or isn't he? because there is just as much evidence either way. Remember the orientation video when experimenting with time traveling rabbits resulted in a duplicating two identical rabbits?

There has been NO indication on the show that jacob's nemesis changes shape or that he is directly connected with the smoke monster, especially considering the role the monster has played already does NOT match that of jacob's nemesis and your quote to back this up being taken out of context.

"In the opening of "The Incident," the nemesis seems quite judgmental toward humanity, stating that it "all ends the same." This parallel between the monster and the nemesis seem to match up well."

Nemesis - "it always ends the same way"
jacob - "it only ends once, everything else is just progress"

This is not the nemesis being judgmental towards humanity but outlining their difference of belief.

I could say much more objectively to what you have wrote, but then this comment would be huge and I don't mean to break apart your blog, its just it is biased towards your own interpretation that you are passing off as fact instead of taking a real open look at the clues possibilities.

I have also noticed that you have a very black and white view of lost which is something the writers have played with on the show but it is becoming more apparent that there is no black and white, no good guys or bad guys, just difference of belief.

I proudly came up with the same parallel between t...

2009-08-04T21:46:27.180-07:00

I proudly came up with the same parallel between the smoke monster and "Stan" (close name to Satan), as my brother and I call him. Thanks for sort of verifying the validity of my theory.

Ha Ha! You all have great theories related to the ...

2009-08-03T07:24:09.973-07:00

Ha Ha! You all have great theories related to the show.

Please remember FRANK LAPIDUS' selection as a "Possible Candidate".

If the Smoke Monster/Nemesis can shape shift.

Can Jacob/White monster shape shift?

I believe he can, and Frank Lapidus will be chosen as a new "host" for Jacob.

Mayhaps the 'old man' we saw in 'jacob's cabin' was lapidus from the future. (looks like jeff fahey!?)

Maybe not...

Since the nemesis possessed Locke, have we seen Lo...

2009-07-17T21:44:58.588-07:00

Since the nemesis possessed Locke, have we seen Locke and the Monster on screen at the same time ever? The one time Ben tried to call it it didn't come, and then when they went to go see it Locke stayed above while Ben had his little chat. Any ideas?

I believe that the smoke monster is a judge, that ...

2009-06-06T12:04:22.673-07:00

I believe that the smoke monster is a judge, that being the reason why jacob and his nemesis cannot kill eachother as the one remaining would die as the result of the judgement by the monster

There are some enormous gaps in my thinking about ...

2009-05-27T15:22:37.141-07:00

There are some enormous gaps in my thinking about this one, but I reckon that the 'black smoke' monster is Jacob's nemesis in a disembodied form and that the guy in black that we saw on the beach was just another 'host'. Now that Jacob's 'host' has finally been killed off, i reckon that we might see a 'white smoke' monster or similar).

what if he is not Jacob's "nemesis" at all? when ...

2009-05-26T21:35:45.036-07:00

what if he is not Jacob's "nemesis" at all? when he asked Jacob if he knew how badly he wanted to kill him, and Jacob confirmed, then he said that he would find a loophole and Jacob told him that he would find him there waiting for him. Just the way they were discussing it made me think that they weren't enemies. Maybe killing Jacob isn't a bad thing, maybe in some way it is helping Jacob take another form, or helping him somehow?

My husband raised a great point, asking whether or...

2009-05-24T17:41:56.562-07:00

My husband raised a great point, asking whether or not anyone involved in the show is named Jacob--i.e., a very postmodern move if the author was Jacob. Well, guess what the second "J" in J. J. Abrams stands for? Yup: Jacob.

anyone comments on the fact that jacob visits kate...

2009-05-24T05:37:11.493-07:00

anyone comments on the fact that jacob visits kate and sawer as childs but others as older ones
? he brings jack when ben gets cancer??? any ideas?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9286901@N06/355921134...

2009-05-24T02:40:51.890-07:00

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9286901@N06/3559211346/
here is a photo of jacob from jacob's cabin in season 3 and the guy wanting to kill jacob. they look strangely familar

One thing I haven't seen mentioned. I agree that ...

2009-05-22T16:15:04.314-07:00

One thing I haven't seen mentioned.

I agree that one of the logical ideas of the manifestations of the deceased are that they are the Nemesis, who I also believe to be the smoke monster. However, Walt is an obvious contradiction to the idea that one must be dead, with their body on the island, to be impersonated. And... Can Nemesis be two at once? This is the part I haven't seen discussed. If Christian Shepherd is Nemesis, then who was Claire? They were both together, we have not seen Claire at all since, she certainly was NOT herself... Was she still alive and being manipulated, a la the French folks (pun intended)? Or was Nemesis two at once? Or, a third option, are there ADDITIONAL means for manifestations, besides Nemesis. Are Charlie, et al., who visit Hurley Nemesis, or does he really talk to ghosts? We know the dead can talk, Miles communicates with them all the time.

Just another thought to muddy the waters. :)

Oh, and although Richard Alpert has the appearance of a traditional ancient egyptian, eyeliner and all, and the temple and statue appear traditional ancient Egyptian, the trappings, furnishings and tapestry decorating Jacob's abode clearly show Greek influence, as in Ptolemaic Egyptian. Are we actually seeing something as silly here as the culmination of an ancient culture war?

Get a girlfriend! Bunch of losers.

2009-05-21T22:26:33.858-07:00

Get a girlfriend!
Bunch of losers.

Ok, i think that Jacobs nemesis is the smoke monst...

2009-05-21T06:39:41.480-07:00

Ok, i think that Jacobs nemesis is the smoke monster too. And that the smoke monster can inhabit dead people on the island. Therefore, in the beginning of the finale when we see jacob and his nemesis talking, these bodies are actually people who have died on the island and are being used at that moment by the smoke monster (NEMESIS) and possibly a white smoke monster (JACOB). In season 6, i think we will learn about the history of these two bodies (not necessarily about Nemesis and Jacob). These two men must have been on the island at some point, died, and they are now just one form of bodies that Jacob and Nemesis use. I think season 6 will end with smoke monster inhabiting one of our losties (its locke at the moment) and also good smoke monster (jacob) inhabithing another lostie. Therefore, for example, Locke vs Jack could actually turn into Nemesis vs Jacob. Locke has already died and been inhabited by smokey. So, if it happens to Jack, he will have to die, and become Jacob.

Yet Isis would not despair. She implored the help ...

2009-05-21T00:49:42.658-07:00

Yet Isis would not despair. She implored the help of her sister Nephthys, kind Nephthys, to guide her and help her find the pieces of Osiris. Long did they search, bringing each piece to Thoth that he might work magic upon it. When all the pieces were together, Thoth went to Anubis, lord of the dead. Anubis sewed the pieces back together, washed the entrails of Osiris, embalmed him wrapped him in linen, and cast the Ritual of Life. When Osiris' mouth was opened, his spirit reentered him and he lived again.
Yet nothing that has died, not even a god, may dwell in the land of the living. Osiris went to Duat, the abode of the dead. Anubis yielded the throne to him and he became the lord of the dead. There he stands in judgment over the souls of the dead. He commends the just to the Blessed Land, but the wicked he condemns to be devoured by Ammit.
When Set heard that Osiris lived again he was wroth, but his anger waned, for he knew that Osiris could never return to the land of the living. Without Osiris, Set believed he would sit on the throne of the gods for all time. Yet on his island, Horus, the son of Osiris and Isis, grew to manhood and strength. Set sent many serpents and demons to kill Horus, but he defeated them. When he was ready, his mother Isis gave him great magic to use against Set, and Thoth gave him a magic knife.
Horus sought out Set and challenged him for the throne. Set and Horus fought for many days, but in the end Horus defeated Set and castrated him. But Horus, merciful Horus, would not kill Set, for to spill the blood of his uncle would make him no better than he. Set maintained his claim to the throne, and Horus lay claim himself as the son of Osiris. The gods began to fight amongst another, those who supported Horus and those who supported Set. Banebdjetet leaped into the middle and demanded that the gods end this struggle peacefully or Maat would be imbalanced further. He told the gods to seek the council of Neith. Neith, warlike though wise in council, told them that Horus was the rightful heir to the throne. Horus cast Set into the darkness where he lives to this day.
And so it is that Horus watches over us while we live, and gives guidance to the Pharaoh while he lives, and his father Osiris watches over us in the next life. So it is that the gods are at peace. So it is that Set, wicked Set, eternally strives for revenge, battling Horus at every turn. When Horus wins, Maat is upheld and the world is at peace. When Set wins, the world is in turmoil. But we know that dark times do not last forever, and the bright rays of Horus will shine over us again. In the last days, Horus and Set will fight one last time for the world. Horus will defeat Set forever, and Osiris will be able to return to this world. On that day, the Day of Awakening, all the tombs shall open and the just dead shall live again as we do, and all sorrow shall pass away forever.

i believe it all goes back to the gods of ancient ...

2009-05-21T00:48:49.394-07:00

i believe it all goes back to the gods of ancient egypt, the legend of Osiris in particular.. sorry i know its a little long but it all fits in... i believ Jacob and his nemesis are Set and Horus.. plz read and let me know what u guys think...
in the Golden Age when the gods walked upon the earth with us. Know then that in those ancient days, Osiris the great-grandson of Ra sat upon the throne of the gods, ruling over the living world as Ra did over the gods. He was the first Pharaoh, and his Queen, Isis, was the first Queen. They ruled for many ages together, for the world was still young and Grandmother Death was not as harsh as she is now.
His ways were just and upright, he made sure that Maat remained in balance, that the law was kept. And so Maat smiled upon the world. All peoples praised Osiris and Isis, and peace reigned over all, for this was the Golden Age.
Yet there was trouble. Proud Set, noble Set, the brother of Osiris, he who defended the Sun Boat from Apep the Destroyer, was unsettled in his heart. He coveted the throne of Osiris. He coveted Isis. He coveted the power over the living world and he desired to take it from his brother. In his dark mind he conceived of a plot to kill Osiris and take all from him. He built a box and inscribed it with wicked magic that would chain anyone who entered it from escaping.
Set took the box to the great feast of the gods. He waited until Osiris had made himself drunk on much beer, then challenged Osiris to a contest of strength. Each one in turn would enter the box, and attempt, through sheer strength, to break it open. Osiris, sure in his power yet feeble in mind because of his drink, entered the box. Set quickly poured molten lead into the box. Osiris tried to escape, but the wicked magic held him bound and he died. Set then picked up the box and hurled it into the Nile where it floated away.
Set claimed the throne of Osiris for himself and demanded that Isis be his Queen. None of the other gods dared to stand against him, for he had killed Osiris and could easily do the same to them. Great Ra turned his head aside and mourned, he did not stand against Set.
This was the dark time. Set was everything his brother was not. He was cruel and unkind, caring not for the balance of Maat, or for us, the children of the gods. War divided Egypt, and all was lawless while Set ruled. In vain our people cried to Ra, but his heart was hardened by grief, and he would not listen.
Only Isis, blessed Isis, remembered us. Only she was unafraid of Set. She searched all of the Nile for the box containing her beloved husband. Finally she found it, lodged in a tamarisk bush that had turned into a mighty tree, for the power of Osiris still was in him, though he lay dead. She tore open the box and wept over the lifeless body of Osiris. She carried the box back to Egypt and placed it in the house of the gods. She changed herself into a bird and flew about his body, singing a song of mourning. Then she perched upon him and cast a spell. The spirit of dead Osiris entered her and she did conceive and bear a son whose destiny it would be to avenge his father. She called the child Horus, and hid him on an island far away from the gaze of his uncle Set.
She then went to Thoth, wise Thoth, who knows all secrets, and implored his help. She asked him for magic that could bring Osiris back to life. Thoth, lord of knowledge, who brought himself into being by speaking his name, searched through his magic. He knew that Osiris' spirit had departed his body and was lost. To restore Osiris, Thoth had to remake him so that his spirit would recognize him and rejoin. Thoth and Isis together created the Ritual of Life, that which allows us to live forever when we die. But before Thoth could work the magic, cruel Set discovered them. He stole the body of Osiris and tore it into many pieces, scattering them throughout Egypt. He was sure that Osiris would never be reborn.

.....continued next blog below

please answer my questions.i beg you 1.how r u gu...

2009-05-21T00:05:58.783-07:00

please answer my questions.i beg you

1.how r u guys sure that jacob's nemesis is in the form of locke?how did he took locke's boy?

2.is locke really dead?

3.who r the ppl in the black rock?

4.what makes jacob so powerful?

Th free will vs fate would be a great theory if bo...

2009-05-20T03:18:22.118-07:00

Th free will vs fate would be a great theory if both didn't knew the rules of the game, but they both know how it will end, the midle it's just progress, so they both belive in predefined lines for our lives.

I Ben has compared Locke with Moses? For sure it w...

2009-05-20T03:13:35.755-07:00

I Ben has compared Locke with Moses? For sure it wasn't unintentional, do you agree?

František, that was awesome!

2009-05-20T01:06:56.398-07:00

František, that was awesome!

I agree with most of what you've said, but I think...

2009-05-19T23:17:52.346-07:00

I agree with most of what you've said, but I think there are a couple fallacies. You said:

"The monster appears to be sort of a judge and jury of the Islanders, forgiving Ben but executing Eko for his sins."

No. Much more likely that the smoke monster is looking into people's hearts and keeping them alive based on their propensity to be manipulated.

If you'll recall, he liked what he saw in the trusting patsy Locke in the Pilot, just after it killed the airline pilot. Ben as a selfish manipulator is easily manipulated. But not even the saintly brother of Ecko could convince him that he was a sinner. No, Ecko was not killed because he was a sinner. He wasn't. Echo did what he had to in order to save people from a terrible world. His last words to his specter brother, in escalating rage, were, "Who are you?" He was killed because he was catching on to the ruse.

Secondly, Jacob can be seen. That's proved. We have yet to see that Anti-Jacob can be seen by anyone but immortals. Better to assume he's a specter (and therefore has to inhabit dead bodies to communicate). So at least one possible scenario is that AJ, tired of the island reruns of banality and violence, can't leave until his physical friend no longer has a body...and dead bodies can't act or kill.

Maybe they are two halves of the same God... both would explain why he can't kill him with his own hand. We just don't know enough yet:)

http://www.onentofl.com/magnushanso.html http://w...

2009-05-19T18:38:03.710-07:00

http://www.onentofl.com/magnushanso.html

http://www.onentofl.com/magnushanso.html

http://www.onentofl.com/magnushanso.html

http://www.onentofl.com

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I know this is not exactly on topic, but are we to...

2009-05-19T15:17:36.223-07:00

I know this is not exactly on topic, but are we to think that ben does not kill his father after all, since things are now "Changed?" Has there already be a discussion of this?

The Nemesis says "Do you have any idea how badly I...

2009-05-19T11:51:00.000-07:00

The Nemesis says "Do you have any idea how badly I want to kill you?" This is an odd line.

First, it kind of kills the (otherwise very nice) 3 Fates theory. Same goes for the Yin/Yang. All of these forces depend on each other.

It also somewhat kills the Jacob/Esau theory as they were more rivals for their father's affection, not necessarily murderous.

All I can think is the Buddhist saying "If you meet the Buddha, kill him," which means that Buddha is supposed to be internal to every human being, and anyone claiming sole ownership of that title is false.

That definitely gels with the overall theme of "the island" and its magical powers. Everyone (Jacob included) from Ben to Widmore to Dharma wants to control the island, but that is impossible.

So maybe some are just more adept at surviving than others, traversing time, manipulating people, etc, but in the end no one will "win."

Anonymous above me: Did you even watch the finale?...

2009-05-19T10:29:00.000-07:00

Anonymous above me: Did you even watch the finale?

how do you know that locke is actually jacob's nem...

2009-05-19T08:45:00.000-07:00

how do you know that locke is actually jacob's nemesis?where,when,how did it happen?and if it is true.does this mean that john locke is really dead?please answer me.i beg u!!!